Squeeze Ball, Legal or not????

[taff426]

Gents,

Could someone please try to clear up the legality of the squeeze ball please. I was always under the impression that the squeeze ball was illegal, however, it was 'allowed' in certain positions, i.e, if the opposition are not contesting the ball in the ruck situation , which, is how I referee the situation personally.

However, a few weeks ago when I questioned this with an AR (of AVIVA Premiership fame) he advised me that the squeeze ball is and always has been legal :chin:

Could someone please give me definitive answer please.

 

[Phil E]

It is legal at U19 and adult rugby, providing it is done quickly. The ball must come out like the proverbial rat out of a drainpipe.

It is illegal at U18 and below.

 

[crossref]

might add - at U18 and below = PK

 

[PaulDG]

might add - at U18 and below = PK

In England, anyway. (And any coach coaching the technique can expect a severe response from the RFU).

Don't know what the situation is in Wales though.

 

[richie]

illegal and PK at U 19 and below in ireland

 

[Enrique]

Illegal at all levels in Argentina.

 

[Dixie]

Legal? Depends what you mean. There's no mention of it in the LoTG, either allowing or disallowing it.

Tackled player is allowed to "immediately" place the ball before rolling away "immediately". Clearly, if the opponent is disadvantaged by the squeezeball, then this requirement has not been met and PK. If the ball appears between the legs with the speed of greased weasel poo, then it's probably not going to disadvantage the oppo. Play on.

 

[TigerCraig]

Legal at all levels in Australia - subject to being quick if there is a contest

 

[Dickie E]

Legal at all levels in Australia - subject to being quick if there is a contest

I'm not so sure. Illegal for juniors in Oz as I understand it.

 

[Taff]

Legal? Depends what you mean. There's no mention of it in the LoTG, either allowing or disallowing it.

Tackled player is allowed to "immediately" place the ball before rolling away "immediately". Clearly, if the opponent is disadvantaged by the squeezeball, then this requirement has not been met and PK. If the ball appears between the legs with the speed of greased weasel poo, then it's probably not going to disadvantage the oppo. Play on.

So what is the offence? Is it "blocking the ball" or "dangerous play"? :chin:

 

[crossref]

squeeze ball is judged dangerous to the person doing it... for adults, shrug, they take their own risks, for juniors RFU takes on some care and it's banned.

but blocking the ball is an offence however you do it squeeze ball is a technique that mght well cause a block.

 

[Deeps]

So what is the offence? Is it "blocking the ball" or "dangerous play"? :chin:

You can start with Law 15.5 (a), the argument being that the tackled player employing 'squeeze ball' potentially denies the immediate availability of the ball. Those employing squeeze ball legally must do so very quickly to avoid the offence of denying immediate access to the ball.

For U18 rugby in England et al, the posture assumed by a player squeezing a ball in this manner is deemed unsafe as it renders the tackled player liable to serious injury. Although this posture is perhaps not clearly defined, the act of performing 'squeeze ball' in U18 rugby is unequivocally in itself illegal without any further need to define why and is punished by a PK.

 

[chopper15]

Ref. OB. replying to my query: Posing the question as an 'outsider'; are there any circumstances when refs agreeing to disagree can be tolerated?

No. When this situation arises, somebody needs to make a ruling asap. Institutional inconsistency would be very confusing for the players.

And, pray, who should this 'somebody' be, OB?

Shouldn't the enthusiastic/dedicated 'grass-roots' demand a more direct route to the law lords? The complacent 'elite' could then learn a thing or two too.:clap:

As an outsider I find it very irritating that some respected monitor doesn't take on a consensus summary (even if that also may need further amendment) when a thread series is heading for a stalemate.:sad:

 

[Simon Thomas]

And, pray, who should this 'somebody' be, OB?

Shouldn't the enthusiastic/dedicated 'grass-roots' demand a more direct route to the law lords? The complacent 'elite' could then learn a thing or two too.

As an outsider I find it very irritating that some respected monitor doesn't take on a consensus summary (even if that also may need further amendment) when a thread series is heading for a stalemate.:sad:

as as "somebody" who makes those decisions perhaps I can answer :

In the real world, not on this interweb cyber Forum, that is exactly what happens.

if we as a Society have an isue to debate we do so, and if there is not total total consensus the Committee will take all the views in mind and state that consensus. or it may just be a clarification or guidance issue myself as Chairman or KML1 as TDO will make it. It may be we agree to disagree and that will be stated, but we have to have consistency for the clubs.

That is what we and the Committee were elected for.

if we need to we will go to RFU Refs Dept - to our Regional Manager Clare or direct to Richard G-J or DB (who go direct to IRB).

As for us as a Committee, we have slightly more experience than current enthusiatic/dedicated grass-roots, which is where we all started. Every member however new is given every opportunity to make their own views known and discussed.

 

[OB..]

Shouldn't the enthusiastic/dedicated 'grass-roots' demand a more direct route to the law lords? The complacent 'elite' could then learn a thing or two too.:clap:

The "enthusiastic/dedicated grass roots" might also learn a thing or two from the "complacent elite". The implication that the grass roots know best would be hard to substantiate.

As an outsider I find it very irritating that some respected monitor doesn't take on a consensus summary (even if that also may need further amendment) when a thread series is heading for a stalemate.:sad:

This is a discussion forum, not a legislative body, nor even a pressure group.

 

[chopper15]

This is a discussion forum, not a legislative body, nor even a pressure group.

No enlightenment here then. :sad:

PS Simon/OB; my thanks for your detailed reply. Much appreciated particularly as it was from an outsider.

 

[TigerCraig]

I'm not so sure. Illegal for juniors in Oz as I understand it.

Not in NSW at least. Our head of referees,Ron mancell sent out a clarification to all of us earlier this year. Posted on this site somewhere a little while back

 

[B52 REF]

i disallowed it (just a gentle "no squeezeball please we're playing boys laws " (yes i know before you all shout) ) at a ladies uni game weds. whereupon the squeezer asked "whats squeezeball sir???" her oppo immediately grabbed the ball, dropped into the mud and demoed it to all saying he's right (er, no). but why illegal asked another "coz it will get stuck under your fat thighs" came the chorus.

 

[Lee Lifeson-Peart]

"coz it will get stuck under your fat thighs" came the chorus.

Ohhhh God! That was last thing I wanted think about. (Jarvis aka Rob Newman)