Leggings

Scarlet Al


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I know there's a couple of threads on this... Had email correspondence with a high up at the WRU Referees department recently who said he'd emailed the IRB who said they're illegal, there has been a lot of debate amongst ref's in these parts about them... Found on NS7 site today: http://www.ns7.co.uk/news.htm

OFFICIAL NOTICE TO ALL PLAYERS



The use of leggings/tights/skins has been outlawed by the IRB as from 1st March 2010 and ratified by the R.F.U.



Therefore the use of the above is NOT allowed at the National Sevens.



This applies equally to the BOYS and GIRLS tournaments




Can't find anything on the IRB site or RFU site to support this, although a high up at the WRU has told me they are not allowed.
 

Simon Thomas


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Use of leggings is a particular "bete noir" of mine.

I have had extensive conversations and email communications with DB of RFU on the topic (he is RFU Law Rep in liaison with IRB).

The guidance is clear - they are not allowed for playing.

NSS is organised by London Society (of which DB is a Commitee man, salaried RFU London & SE Referee Development Manager, etc) and London Society have made a very clear ruling through the NSS web site.

At our Society meeting I made it very clear to Hampshire's Refs that they should not be allowed in our County.

I will try to get some RFU or IRB documentation to support this.
 

Casey Bee


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Use of leggings is a particular "bete noir" of mine.

I have had extensive conversations and email communications with DB of RFU on the topic (he is RFU Law Rep in liaison with IRB).

The guidance is clear - they are not allowed for playing.

NSS is organised by London Society (of which DB is a Commitee man, salaried RFU London & SE Referee Development Manager, etc) and London Society have made a very clear ruling through the NSS web site.

At our Society meeting I made it very clear to Hampshire's Refs that they should not be allowed in our County.

I will try to get some RFU or IRB documentation to support this.

Does anyone find there is a correlation between a player's wearing of leggings, fluorescent boots, non standard team shorts and his desire to give running commentary on the game, decisions etc?
 

Bunniksider


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I have encouraged my U8's to wear thermal leggings & undershirts this year whilst we have been coaching & playing Tag Rugby. The last thing I wanted was a handful of cold and miserable kids on a Sunday morning.

What do people think about their use next year when we move on to contact?

I'm inclined to think that I will still allow/recommend it for a couple of years as I don't want them frozen out of the game.
 

Wert Twacky


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I think there's a big difference between league fixtures/national tournos, etc, and under-8s running about on a chilly Sunday morning.

For juniors training and even in matches I'd think anyone/referee who outlawed this needs a rocket.

As for older age groups/seniors, etc - different story. They're banned.
 

didds

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has anyone a reference/source for this (pref online) and its extensions within the junior and child age groups (see above two comments which i entirely concur with)?

cheers

didds
 

Simon Thomas


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especially if he is also wearing white socks and has number 11 or 14 on his back :D
 

Casey Bee


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especially if he is also wearing white socks and has number 11 or 14 on his back :D

Ha ha, sounds about right!
Saw a prime example on Sat - 14 whinged at ref 'he tripped me', ref was already running off. Turned to me at TJ, 'didn't you see him trip me?'.
My reply was 'no I didnt see that'.
My thought was 'What I saw was you pussy out of taking your oppo on and slow up whereupon he dumped you, quite legitimately; you are now whining as a guy half your size bested you. Spend more time on your sidestep and acceration drills rather than shining your yellow boots and looking in the mirror.'
 

Simon Thomas


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May I repeat what I wrote above :

The guidance is clear - they are not allowed for playing. Not sure how plainer that can be ?

Also to be very clear I have been told by RFU that there is no intention to ask kids of continuum age groups to remove leggings even in matches. And a sensible coach on cold days would encourage their use or track suit trousers.

Likewise we all need to show some common sense - when I reffed a match in full tracksuit and wet weather gear with bobble hat in Estonia a few years ago all the players had tracksuit trousers or ladies tights on - it was -15 !

Didds - as I said above I have asked for RFU / IRB documentation
 

oldman


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I must admit to letting players, at junior and senior games. play in tights.
I have far more important things to worry about that the guy in tights.
Perhaps the 'blazers' should worry about more important things - the decline in adult playing numbers,the fall out of players after they leave school, the scrum and constant collapses, referee abuse. I'm sure other's can add more. No the guy in tights can play he's not going to harm anyone and at least he plays each week.
 

Casey Bee


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I must admit to letting players, at junior and senior games. play in tights.
I have far more important things to worry about that the guy in tights.
Perhaps the 'blazers' should worry about more important things - the decline in adult playing numbers,the fall out of players after they leave school, the scrum and constant collapses, referee abuse. I'm sure other's can add more. No the guy in tights can play he's not going to harm anyone and at least he plays each week.

They are not permitted. By allowing them to be worn you are allowing people to 'chisel' at laws which accelerates declining standards in all areas including as you mention referee abuse.
Are you suggesting that the player who plays every week wearing tights, will no longer play if they are told not to wear them? I expect their team mates, the vast majority of whom survive without tights, will talk them round.
There aren't many players who don't know they are not permitted, and who would comply if asked.
 
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Simon Thomas


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I must admit to letting players, at junior and senior games. play in tights.
I have far more important things to worry about that the guy in tights.
Perhaps the 'blazers' should worry about more important things - the decline in adult playing numbers,the fall out of players after they leave school, the scrum and constant collapses, referee abuse. I'm sure other's can add more. No the guy in tights can play he's not going to harm anyone and at least he plays each week.

Your choice Oldman until told otherwise by London, but it wouldn't be as a referee in our Society and I suspect DB will not be in agreement with you in London either. Rugby has an ethos and culture and looking like a prima ballerina is not one of them. Of course all match officials have lots to think about, but correct attire for players (and themselves) is a basic and easy issue to deal with.

Some of the RFU 'blazers' (as you call them) are involved in a lot of hard work and allocated significant RFU budgets to work on the areas you comment on, plus lots lots more :

decline in adult playing numbers ? not according to the Sport England surveys and numbers registered on RugbyFirst. Play-On scheme has had a positive effect too.

School leavers / Univ kids leaving the Game is nothing new - it was the same 30 years ago ! RFU Policy Pillar of 16-24 initiatives, RUSLOs, etc has had a positive retention effect in last 5 seasons. Success of inititives like Cronk-Cunis Festival are evidence of this. Two whole new Old Boys clubs have emerged after Cronk Cunis re-unions.

Scrum collapses etc are an Elite Game issue - I see very few in the Community Game, where the blazers ensure through Society training and assessment that our referees do it right.

Referee abuse - on this issue the ultimate blazer (Francis Baron) has personally been involved in setting policy and action. Societies and CBs are working hard to clamp down on it - perhaps the clubs, players and coaches should look at their own behaviour and self-discpline first !

And by the way, I am not a full time 'blazer' as I still referee every week, assess every week too, and am a pain in the backside to quite a few of the full time blazers at the RFU.
 

crossref


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Perhaps the 'blazers' should worry about more important things - the decline in adult playing numbers,the fall out of players after they leave school, the scrum and constant collapses, referee abuse. I'm sure other's can add more.

I couldn't agree more.

I'd add : enforcing a single se of laws in youth rugby, so that it's played the same at clubs and schools. It's ludicrous expecting a 12 year old to play to one set of laws on Saturday and another on Sunday.
 

Simon Thomas


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RFU and IRB refer me to 2006 Law Ruling documentation :

IRB Law Ruling 14 November 2006
The FFR has requested a ruling with regard to Law 4 Players’ Clothing.
Please provide a definition of jersey, shorts and underwear.
The Designated Members have ruled the following in answer to the question
raised:
1. Jersey: a close fitting shirt worn on the upper half of the body which is not
attached to shorts or underwear.
2. Shorts: trousers that start at the waist and end above the knees, have an
elasticised waist band and/or draw string, and are not attached to the jersey
or underwear.
3. Underwear: an undergarment, that covers the body from the waist, having
short or no legs but does end above the knees, and worn next to the skin or
under clothing, and not attached to the jersey or shorts.
Page 5 of 7
RULING 4: 2006
Law Ruling by Designated Members of Rugby Committee
14 June 2006
 

PaulDG


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Also to be very clear I have been told by RFU that there is no intention to ask kids of continuum age groups to remove leggings even in matches. And a sensible coach on cold days would encourage their use or track suit trousers.

Likewise we all need to show some common sense - when I reffed a match in full tracksuit and wet weather gear with bobble hat in Estonia a few years ago all the players had tracksuit trousers or ladies tights on - it was -15 !

Didds - as I said above I have asked for RFU / IRB documentation

And they need to understand the need for confirming what you've written above loud and clear in the Continuum and junior variations.

Because when, not if, this causes disputes pitchside with Old Wangerians U9s, the people trying to do the sensible thing of keeping children safe and comfortable in poor conditions need to have the backing of the RFU in writing. Not some vague notion that "sensible people would understand this".

Because "sensible people" coach U7s to cavalry charge, U8s to contest 3 man scrums, U9 scrum halves to follow the ball onto the opposition side of the scrum and U9 backs to walk forward while the "referee" coaches (out of necessity) the scrum.
 

Dixie


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Even at continuum age groups, tracksuit bottoms with zips should not be worn - even if the zip is initially tucked into a sock. Any tackler may slide down so that the zip makes contact with the eye, and you would far prefer to be taken to task for giving a chap chilly legs than for blinding his opponent. The same risk applies to zipped pockets, where the initial hit of the tackle will bring the eye and the zip into far too close proximity for anyone's comfort.
 

Taff


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Sorry gents, but I'm struggling to imagine what "Leggins" or "Tights" even look like. :eek:

Anyone got a photo or possibly a link to some on a retailers site?
 

Rit Hinners

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Sorry gents, but I'm struggling to imagine what "Leggins" or "Tights" even look like. :eek:

Anyone got a photo or possibly a link to some on a retailers site?

It's easy to visualise. Just picture your clubs front row in ballet kit and you'll have it. Oh, replace the tutu with rugby shorts.
 

Simon Thomas


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PaulDG - I am informing my members in the Society and with my CB Executive Director & Youth Committee to our Clubs that in line with IRB/RFU guidance and Law Ruling 4 2006

a) leggings are not legal match wear for Adult and older Youth matches

b) subject to weather conditions, or even personal preferences with discretion, at Continuum level they can be worn. Coaches and referees should use common sense.

Perhaps East Midlands should do the same - I know you have good guys like John Wearing and Paul Rogers on board.
 

OB..


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I have far more important things to worry about that the guy in tights.
Perhaps the 'blazers' should worry about more important things - the decline in adult playing numbers,the fall out of players after they leave school, the scrum and constant collapses, referee abuse.

Dealing with clothing takes place just before the match starts. That does not conflict with anything else in your list, so is no excuse for not dealing with it.
 
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