Lost Voice

Na Madrai


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Level 7 league match, run away leaders against mid-table.

Ten minutes into the second half, my voice deteriorated into a very high pitched squeak - I had picked up a bit of a cold during the week but nothing to write home about. After two scrums with my voice in this condition, both props on the far side from me complained that they could not hear my invitation to set. At the next scrum, I informed both sets of forwards that the CBS instructions would be replaced by very short peeps on the whistle and, because of the inherit dangers of such, a loud blast at any time, meant everybody stop everything immediately.

There were three more scrums and they passed without incident, TG.

However, an employee of the RU, had a liveried car and everything, informed me that if I was unable to give verbal orders (sic) then I should have abandoned the match rather than misuse the whistle. He is apparently going to lodge a formal complaint with the Society!

I have no real worries, I was aware of the potential problem and dealt with them as best I could but am interested in how other members would deal with the problem of losing their voice.

No ARs, incidently, and after the match, many forwards stated that it made their job easier at the engagement as the instructions were so clear.

NM
 
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Toby Warren


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Level 7 league match, run away leaders against mid-table.

Ten minutes into the second half, my voice deteriorated into a very high pitched squeak - I had picked up a bit of a cold during the week but nothing to write home about. After two scrums with my voice in this condition, both props on the far side from me complained that they could not hear my invitation to set. At the next scrum, I informed both sets of forwards that the CBS instructions would be replaced by very short peeps on the whistle and, because of the inherit dangers of such, a loud blast at any time, meant everybody stop everything immediately.

There were three more scrums and they passed without incident, TG.

However, an employee of the RU, had a liveried car and everything, informed me that if I was unable to give verbal orders (sic) then I should have abandoned the match rather than misuse the whistle. He is apparently going to lodge a formal complaint with the Society!

I have no real worries, I was aware of the potential problem and dealt with them as best I could but am interested in how other members would deal with the problem of losing their voice.

No ARs, incidently, and after the match, many forwards stated that it made their job easier at the engagement as the instructions were so clear.

NM
I'd have misused the whistle on the RFU employee :bday:
 

The Fat


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However, an employee of the RU, had a liveried car and everything, informed me that if I was unable to give verbal orders (sic) then I should have abandoned the match rather than misuse the whistle. He is apparently going to lodge a formal complaint with the Society!NM


Just going out on a limb here, but was said RU man connected in some way to the losing team?
Sounds like a bit of a w@^k&r. He could have suggested that you check what you should do in similar situations for future reference, but to come out and say he was lodging a formal complaint straight up???? Like I said, sounds like a bit of a w@^k&r.
 
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Lee Lifeson-Peart


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I wonder if the RFU man's car is liveried a bit like Alan Partridge's.
 

Camquin

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From your description it sounds as if the front row union would back you up in any subsequent discussion.
If it makes the scrum engagement easier or quicker surely we should look to trial it more widely rather than condemn it.
 

Simon Thomas


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putting on my various 'official' RFU and Society hats (past and present) :

well done on your initiative to use the whistle, clearly communicated in advance, and in the interests of completing the match and with safety as your primary concern.

Perhaps for those last three scrums I might have considered going to unopposed as a final safety measure ?

RFU employees are there to deliver services to the Game in England, and work constructively with the many volunteers involved. Unless he/she was the Area Development Manager or Area Development Officer he/she is acting outside their brief, and above their pay grade for starters. RFU employees I know would maybe have had a quiet word, mentioned it was an unusual solution and left it at that with you. An informal call to Society Chairman / TDO / SADOI might take place, but a 'formal complaint' is a little extreme.

In our Society I would back you all the way and put the liveried car RFU enmployee firmly back in their junior level box.
 

Stuartg


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What is our aim? To enable two teams to have a safe and enjoyable game. Did yoy accomplish this? If yes, then the RFU man can drive his liveried car where the sun doesn't shine. He's lost sight of what it's all about.
 

Browner

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CBS at your own speed chaps, the hold the push until the ball is in, ANY unsafe play & we go uncontested, does everyone understand ? ....... Ps...... How do scrums proceed in DEAF RUGBY matches?
 

Simon Thomas


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....... Ps...... How do scrums proceed in DEAF RUGBY matches?

I reffed England Deaf XV v Andover XV a few seasons ago as a warm up for them before their international matches.
Firstly not all are totally deaf (the England TH prop at the time played for Petersfield 1st XV at L8 with normal verbal engagement commands).

Beforehand I was asked to use hand signals as well as verbals for CTPE (as it was at the time I think) but with my hands carefully not in the eyeline of the two props. It was something like :

1. Crouch - two hands folding together
2. Touch - hand to hand
3. Pause - hand between props (not at eye level)
4. Engage - hand withdrawn as I stepped back

I cannot recall any problems or it being an issue at all - so assume it had the right controls.
 

Browner

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Front Rowers are 'deaf' to most requests anyway, :shrug: Well done NM
 

crossref


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sounds to me that NM's handling of this unusual situation was sensible and clever.
 

Dickie E


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At the next scrum, I informed both sets of forwards that the CBS instructions would be replaced by very short peeps on the whistle and, because of the inherit dangers of such, a loud blast at any time, meant everybody stop everything immediately.

Lucky we don't use 'engage' anymore or it would have been peep ... peep ... peeppeep :)
 

Daftmedic


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Cousin G was far politer than I would of been. Bet he introduces himself a X RFU instead of, "Hi, I'm X from the Rfu"
 

Na Madrai


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Sorry, all, chapter two.

Had a visit to the pub last night from a home team committee member with whom I played rugby many years ago. The RU employee, who was from the visiting team, had apparently gone round the rugby club bar after I had left, trying to drum up support for his complaint - his team won by 67points incidently. It would appear that he was put firmly in his place by players from both teams who seemed to be of the opinion that the referee had made the best of a poor situation - a view with which I am sure that I can live.

However, the committee member reminded me of a decision I had made during the match which could have consequencies and which again this RU employee had raised.

White were completely dominant throughout this game. Apart from one chip over the top from the scrum half early on in the game, for which he was severely admonished by his captain despite it leading to the first try, they ran everything from everywhere. White had cleanly won a ruck or a maul and the ball had been passed to the outhalf. As soon as it was clear that he had clean possession, I blew up to stop play because, lying in the outside centre position, was a player being treated by the physio and, presumably, a coach.

Once the player had been treated, I explained to both captains that the only reason I had blown was because play was getting too close to the injured player, I was going to restart play with a scrum, white feed and, because white had good clean possession, this scrum would be unopposed giving white good clean possession.

Everyone seemed happy with this at the time but again the RU employee had apparently gone round stating that as I had no backing in law for this decision, it was a second reason for lodging a complaint against me. Although he seemed to get no support, my mate had decided that he would let me know, just in case.

This guy played in the match although I have no idea in which position and I can only think that I must have given a decision against him with which he disagreed!

Either that or perhaps I had met his mother on tour sometime ................

NM
 

crossref


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Na Madrai:266579 said:
Sorry, all, chapter two.

Had a visit to the pub last night from a home team committee member with whom I played rugby many years ago. The RU employee, who was from the visiting team, had apparently gone round the rugby club bar after I had left, trying to drum up support for his complaint - his team won by 67points incidently. It would appear that he was put firmly in his place by players from both teams who seemed to be of the opinion that the referee had made the best of a poor situation - a view with which I am sure that I can live.

However, the committee member reminded me of a decision I had made during the match which could have consequencies and which again this RU employee had raised.

White were completely dominant throughout this game. Apart from one chip over the top from the scrum half early on in the game, for which he was severely admonished by his captain despite it leading to the first try, they ran everything from everywhere. White had cleanly won a ruck or a maul and the ball had been passed to the outhalf. As soon as it was clear that he had clean possession, I blew up to stop play because, lying in the outside centre position, was a player being treated by the physio and, presumably, a coach.

Once the player had been treated, I explained to both captains that the only reason I had blown was because play was getting too close to the injured player, I was going to restart play with a scrum, white feed and, because white had good clean possession, this scrum would be unopposed giving white good clean possession.

Everyone seemed happy with this at the time but again the RU employee had apparently gone round stating that as I had no backing in law for this decision, it was a second reason for lodging a complaint against me. Although he seemed to get no support, my mate had decided that he would let me know, just in case.

This guy played in the match although I have no idea in which position and I can only think that I must have given a decision against him with which he disagreed!

Either that or perhaps I had met his mother on tour sometime ................

NM

On this one, he is right...
 

didds

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I'd say NM is fine with the safety aspect. But I totally disagree with the unopposed scrum bit - no backing in laws for that at all.

didds
 

Browner

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All this sounds like post match bluster , don't worry about it another moment, let him go to all the trouble of 'lodging' its his reputation he'll be damaging more.

Your society might ask him to become an assessor !! Sarc....
 

Stuartg


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So often it is the winning side that moan about the ref. why?
 

leaguerefaus


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No backing in law but still, this guy sounds like a fu**ing tosser. If he reports every referee for every law they misinterpret, he'd be doing it every weekend.

Most people would be happy to have a referee that made the best of the situation (using the whistle when you lost your voice), instead of a referee who calls the game off.

I wouldn't let this moron bother you one bit.
 
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